SPEAKER_00: 0:00

Welcome back to Inspire AI, the podcast where we explore how innovators, entrepreneurs, and leaders are shaping the future with artificial intelligence. I'm your host, Jason McGenthy. Today's episode is about balanced, literally and figuratively. My guest, Vincent Fu, is the founder of Kenneth AI, an AI-powered platform redefining what he calls balanced health. Vincent's journey started back in 2018 with Guinness Barefoot, a minimalist footware. But in 2023, after years of research, mentorship, he made a bold pivot into clinical technology, developing Kenneth Step, a platform that can assess balance, predict fall risk, and help people live longer, healthier, and safer lives. Vincent's vision doesn't stop there. It's working toward a future where balance is considered the next vital sign, on par with heart rate and blood pressure, and even imagining a human digital twin that could transform health care, sports performance, and military readiness. It's a story of grit, reinvention, and purpose. And I think you'll find it just as inspiring as I do. So let's dive in. Vincent, welcome to the show.

SPEAKER_01: 1:25

Well, thank you, Jason. Thank you so much for having me on the call. I'm really excited, and it's an honor for me to share my story and kinda's journey with the community.

SPEAKER_00: 1:36

Fantastic. Let's get started. So can you tell us um start by beginning, start by telling our audience about yourself and the inspiration of bringing you here today?

SPEAKER_01: 1:48

Yeah, so uh thank you again. Uh my name is Vincent Vu. I um originally from Vietnam. Uh I um before immigrate to the U.S., um uh, you know, I spent six years in a refugee camp uh from 1990 to 1996. Um, after the war, of course, um my family escaped uh in the little fishing boat, 165 of us, after days at sea, and we arrived at a refugee camp. Uh spending six years most of the time in a refugee camp, um, as you can imagine, I'm I'm I'm uh in around Barefoot, playing a lot of soccer Barefoot. In 1998, uh we immigrated to the U.S. Uh I first moved to a small town called Sioux City, Iowa. Uh, I went to high school there. My first job, I worked for the farm. And then in 1999, we immigrated to uh we moved to Richmond. So Richmond had been my hometown for my entire life. Uh went to high school, went to Tucker, and went away for college a little bit. I studied architecture uh and then came back to Richmond in 2008. Uh, worked for a small local architecture firm here. And um since then, yeah, this Richmond had been my hometown. And um I I I I um that's where I start my my professional career and also where I started the uh the minimal issue company.

SPEAKER_00: 2:59

Well, that's that's a beautiful start to the episode today, sharing your your backstory, how you made it to the United States and and what you're offering as a as an entrepreneur to to the community around you. So you you mentioned something there, Barefoot, which I I think resonates with your story. Uh in 2018 you launched Kennis Barefoot. What exactly inspired you to do that originally?

SPEAKER_01: 3:23

Yeah, uh absolutely. It was a um from the personal foot injury. So I was uh I left architecture, went and worked for a a manufacturing company as a director of engineering. I travel a lot. And most of my job is pretty promised in meeting travel and my health was declining. So I got into running as a way to just kind of you know minim I manage my stress. And when I got into running, in a couple of weeks into running, I hurt myself, I injured myself. And then I keep going by shoe after shoe, try different running shoe, nothing worked. And one day, one of my mentors uh told me the book called Born to Run. So I read the book, Born to Run, which is um the author, Chris McDougall talked about this group of people in in a remote region of Mexico, uh in the uh Copper Canyon, where they can run for anywhere a long distance, 50 plus mile with a very thin sandal. I read that book, really it brought me back a lot of my early childhood in the refugee camp where I'm barefoot. Here I am uh after you know more than 10 years in the US, my feet just crumbling, falling apart. And um, and then you know, I got to the point that I just got so frustrated, and I that's where I diving deep into uh understanding human evolution. So I went back two million years ago when we become uh bipedo and how we change and uh hunter-gatherer and read a lot of books, and then next thing I know, I started to learn about foot anatomies and human biomechanics. It's just uh I went down this rabbit hole, and and the more I look into that and all the research I look at, it really what I have learned, the fact that from my personal experience, it really the shoe that constricts my natural foot movement, uh, the way we look at modern shoes. So uh I even went and read the book uh Shoe Dog by uh Phil Knight, uh the founder Nike and their story as well, which is very inspiring for me. So, uh, long story short, I get to the point that I decided that, you know what, I'm going to find a solution because I just refute the fact that I'm in my early 30s. I didn't want to go to see podiatrists away, I thought I can buy all these things. And uh all the signs I look at and the story that I read about these group of people in Mexico, and it's really hit home for me that there's a way that we can, you know, we can readact, regain the strength naturally again without going to all these uh what you call medical devices or solution. So what happened during that time? I was um I went back to school to get my MBA, and I remember during that time, one of my first class with design thinking class, and I said, Well, there's an opportunity to apply this concept. I just learned how to solve this problem in a logical way. And that really, um the next thing I know, I end up starting a shoe company, and I didn't have any background in shoe design, manufacturing. Um, so I started to buy a lot of books, talk to a lot of folks, and watch a lot of YouTube video. Um, and and and to be honest, it is our frustration. Uh, that's how I start uh a minimalist shoe company.

SPEAKER_00: 6:22

Incredible, yeah. Frustration. Physical and yeah, and the lack of options. I I hear you. Um personal anecdote here. I I recently discovered how useful it was to get sized for the proper shoe before you know thinking, hey, this this shoe looks good on my feet. I'm gonna use it to run like the next 20 miles. There's so much to be uh gained from properly fitting the right shoes and and getting to know your your your steps and and I think your your company is offering all of that and much, much more. So tell us about uh around 2023, you pivoted to Kenneth AI with uh Kenneth's death uh focused on balance health and fall risk prediction. So what was the turning point that convinced you to uh reinvent the company around that mission?

SPEAKER_01: 7:15

Yeah, that's a great question. So going back to the when we start the the shoe company, the minimal shoe company, the Kenneth's uh barefoot. Well, we we when we start that company, I really look at shoe from through a sign lens. So I say, hey, it's really not about the fashion. We I were for me at that moment, I always care less about fashion. I want to design a shoe that really promotes that natural movement. So long short, we have three products on the market. Two of our products get medical approval from the American Podiatrix Association. And one of our products called the Lucy, which is an everyday walking shoe, one of our best-selling product ever. We we sell that globally. And what happened, I've keep getting um a lot of requests from my customers, especially folks a little bit older, um, say, hey, do you have any shoe that helped with my balance? And you know, so forth and so on. Because the the idea of balance going back to the idea of how can we design shoes that optimize the foot natural movement, not to get in the way, not to provide support, but optimize. So let the foot move naturally. So one day at lunch, I just happened to say, Oh, you know what? Let me let me spend the next 30 minutes, let me dive deep into this whole balance thing and see what's going on. And when when I did that, what really eye-opening for me when I looked at some statistics from our CDC, which he um fought the leading cost of death among the folks over 65 in the U.S. We're spending$480 billion a year now, uh 40,000 death, um, not chronic disease, like we think, but you know, and and and that just really uh took me by surprise. And then when I look at a solution in the market, this hasn't been very um, I'll say sustainable solution. You know, we treat fall as an afterthought, but we don't talk about balance until somebody explains the fall and you go to surgery, and then if you are, if you're alive, you know, some some some people die within six months. And what we did was we went back and we looked at it an opportunity, all the solutions on the market at that point, just very reactive. You know, it's fall detection, but detection that that means somebody already uh hurting, you know, injured right now on the floor, detection not consoled. So uh at that moment, we and you know, at the beginning of that moment, I'm starting to get to learn. Or I read a few books about artificial intelligence, and I see there's an opportunity that we can use artificial intelligence if we can capture enough data. Is there an opportunity for that point that we can predict far risk from the happening in place? And when we look at all the solutions in the market and we look at all the technology, whether sensor technology, whether the the software side, and that's where we decide to pivot that we, hey, there's an opportunity that we can address this problem. I I like to call the silent problem that no one discusses about, but we all relate to it. You know, I I spend a lot of time. So that's where we make the strategic decision, pivot from a minimal footwear company leveraging, but still leveraging all the knowledge that we gained for the last couple of years and carry it on over, but do it learn technology and do it at scale.

SPEAKER_00: 10:12

Yeah. I'm starting to pick up on a pattern in in your life and your approach to problem solving, is where you identify a problem, whether it's impacting you or loved ones, and you dive real deep into it, try to really understand the root cause of that, and then you you go and make it a mission of your own to try to figure out what what can you do to help make a difference in this area? I I I definitely sense that. Um it's I think one of your superpowers, if I could you know, offer that to you. What I'd like to do now is like talk about your pivot, because I know pivots can be difficult for founders. So how do you personally navigate the emotional and strategic challenges of changing course so drastically?

SPEAKER_01: 10:56

That's a great question. It it was difficult by no means. It's it's difficult for me personally because you know I invest so much into the regional company and to get into the revenue stage, and then at that point, um making that so there's an economic impact to me personally, you know, the point. So, but when I look at the problem, I see that and I weigh the risk. At that point, you you you you you're that's where you become very pragmatic. Say, okay, I can be comfortable with what I have right now, but know the fact that by doing so, I start to um I disregard the opportunity to address something at scale, something bigger that no one talks about. What we addressing in that point was a very to me is a very um a temporary solution. And and that market can be quite small, but if we expand, uh we can help people uh with the technology. We help people where they need help the most. Because they because right now, it you know, I spent a lot of time, that's where I got involved with some folks at VCU. We did the capstone and we did the whole customer discovery, long story short, but we spent a lot of time at assisted living facility. And every time we talk to these folks and we hear these stories over and over again, and and and and the more I listen to these stories, the more I think of my my my own father, the more I think of my own family, the more I think about myself. You know, I'm 40 right now. Hey, by the way, I'll get 80, 70, hopefully I leave it long. But but it it impacts all of us. So that is really when I look at that and step back, to me, it's an e no-brainer to make that decision, to make that point. It was difficult, but when I analyze everything, it was the right decision for us as a company. It was risky, but hey, we start out, we start out from nothing in the first place anyway. So it's a natural progression for us.

SPEAKER_00: 12:47

Yeah, it's spoken like a true entrepreneur, someone who wants to make a difference in the lives of others. That's great. And and I I I heard a little bit about your story there and how you leverage the relationships and especially with organizations like VCU. So you've had you know several mentorships from experts like Dr. Stephen Morrison and partnerships with universities, like you said, VCU, GMU. Uh so how did those relationships shape the trajectory of Kenneth's AI?

SPEAKER_01: 13:20

Yeah, I think a lot of that I want to bring Startup Virginia ecosystem into play because throughout Startup Virginia, we've been a member since 2018, Lai Hau Lab. So these would be because these relationships, when I start to talk to these folks, that hey, I want to I want we want to pivot the business to become a technology, uh digital health company. And that's where uh with an ICAP, I got reached out to um to uh um uh I forgot his name, but one of the the leading AI um professor at GMU. At that point, I was, you know, we have this idea, but we have we still haven't figured out the the mechanic behind that. So that's where I reach out and uh and and same thing with Dr. Stephen Morrison that ODU. Unfortunately, he passed away. But he's really the one that that, you know, he's an expert, fall prevention expert. He was very um very grateful to to to meet with me and share with me. And we both believe in this idea that, hey, this we can do this, um, we can predict this thing, we can build these tools. So um, same thing with um uh what the you know, we also apply for the grant to the Virginia Innovation Partnership that believe in our our our you know really our our concept one to put together. So um at the end of the day, you know, we wouldn't be able to do what we do right now without the ecosystem that put in play to support us, whether that start Virginia, uh Lighthouse Lab, Virginia, and of course the grant, the$75,000 grant we receive received from uh the um from the uh the Venice Virginia Innovation Partnership. So, and of course the mentoring from from Dr. Steven and of course um uh some professor at at Joe Mason as well.

SPEAKER_00: 14:56

Yes, and it absolutely takes a village to make great things happen. Sounds like you're leveraging your your network and uh and the network of others to help you and build this this great vision out. So it's really inspiring. Thank you for sharing. So for other entrepreneurs listening, what what advice would you give on how to leverage academic partnerships and grants like BIPC, Commonwealth Commercialization Fund, or NIH, SBIR or real world innovation?

SPEAKER_01: 15:27

Yeah, I think I think the only thing that I only ask um entrepreneur or someone who wants to um to uh get into display, uh all you have to do is, you know, of course, I always start with identify the problem, you know, come up with the you know, spend your time, do your homework, do your market research, do your customer discovery, because what what you want to do, you want to come to the table, at least you have a one thing you need to get down, you need to solidify your problem. Your solution is only as good. And when I teach, you know, I teach as well, when I always talk to my student that your solution is only as good as the problem. Okay, so so for me, is that's why I spent a lot a lot of time understanding the problem because to be sure to be honest with you, before Kenneth's Barefoot, I had three other startups and they all fail. And when I look back at these, the reason why I fail, because again, there's zero product market fit. I jump into the solution. When I jumped into the solution, I didn't spend enough time understanding the pain point, the problem. So I learned from that three mistakes because I made not one, but three same mistakes over and over again. So that's why I'm very adamant about understanding a problem better. You gotta know your problem. You need to know your customer, you gotta know your your market, you gotta know your uh your competition and and understand that. So for me, uh my advisor entrepreneur, it's okay. You don't know what you don't know, but you have to come to the table, present. At least you gotta present your solution. Might not have all the the uh the the resolution or the the detail they got. That's okay, but at least you come with a solid problem statement. Say, this is what the problem, and this is the current solution, this is what the the pain point, this is what the market's saying, and and it has an opportunity for us to look at this and and come up with something, uh a better solution to offer a better value. So um reach out. People, like I say, people from my personal experience, I have been very grateful for all the folks that who helped me over the year. Um, the only thing you're not gonna get help unless you reach out. It's okay. You don't have to know everything. That's why these experts will guide you. You help you to refine a problem.

SPEAKER_00: 17:34

Yeah. Yeah, you mentioned design thinking and uh problem refinement, which goes really well with one of the podcast episodes I recently published on problem finding and communicating uh the issues at hand. And it's it's really, you know, just a side note, it's about like AI helping us to build content and be creators and essentially like you can do all of that, but it it really would benefit like the use case to define the problem really well first, like you're saying, and create a proper mission around that problem so that you're not just endlessly creating new content for no reason and uh solving problems that don't really exist in people's lives. Um sounds to me like you have a really good foundation of identifying problems and uh and researching and and getting uh getting to the you know the the details that matter. And I think that's uh that's probably one of the best foundational starting points before you go and dig into trying to solve for these things. That's great. Thank you for sharing. Um so you've described your mission as making balance health the next vital sign. Can you break down what that means and why balance is such an overlooked aspect of the human health?

SPEAKER_01: 18:55

Yeah, absolutely. I mean, uh as goal going back to the statistic I shared earlier, you know, falling. Yeah, well well, when you look at fall, there are multiple reasons why. And when I talk to Dr. Steve Borson, we identify uh balance deficiency is is one of the the key factor. And of course, we can look at gait. When we look at balance, we look at gait. But for the most part, um we all know someone, whether with one family or intimate in a or someone that or whether have an uh an older person that falls and and whether that injure or pass away. Well, a lot of that, what we're saying that, well, we don't treat balance as something that we we the lonely time, the problem what I'm seeing right now, the way the our system works at the moment, we treat balance an afterthought. We only treat balance, let's say somebody older have some balance mobility problem for whether a hip fracture or whatever that may be. You go to surgery and then you go to to back your PT, and that's where your PT evalues balance. Well, to me, that's a little backward the way we'd look at it. So what we're saying is that if we are checking your blood pressure, your glucose level at the vital sign, but well, guess what? Balance deficiency will ultimately will lead to the fall, will kill you as just like any other thing. So, so, but we don't talk about that because the way we look at it is a very fragmented approach solution. And what we want to do is we want to take, hey, what if, what if we we position balance as the next vital sign by by taking it as a pre-screening tool? That's what we want to position is like, hey, now the next time you go to a primary care doctor, well, you don't have to wait until you fall and go to PT go the traditional round up. Now we want to make to a balance, access balance, um, checking your balance is easy as the next vital sign because it is important for us to do so. And um because right now no one talks about it.

SPEAKER_00: 20:50

Yeah, yeah, it does sound fragmented. So tell tell us a little bit about how your platform, Kenneth Step and Balance Pro, turn everyday movement into measurable, actionable insights for clinicians and patients.

SPEAKER_01: 21:03

Yeah, absolutely. So what we are saying that, hey, Kenneth at Kenneth said heart of us, we are not an AI company. We we are a movement intelligent company. And how what do I mean by that? So so there are two different ways we look at it. AI is a tool, it's part of part of part of our toolbox. Yeah. So for us, we believe in this whole idea of the hybrid care model. So where we bring the we bridge the clinician, the patient, where we provide the data, we empower the clinician, in this case, it could be the doctor, it could be the PT, it could be the LT, with the right data information. And that information also provides the patient the 10th time. So the clinician right now have to make the decision with the right information, most update information, to develop a comprehensive solution for the patient. So the way the platform works that we have, we build uh software and hardware stack. So the first product, what we we talked, when you mentioned the balance pro. A Balant Pro is a um a computer vision technology that we deploy to the iPad. That's all we need. Anywhere you have an access to camera, there's another iPad, you can use an iPhone as well. So we deploy to the clinic within five minutes. We give you a comprehensive balance assessment. We broke the body out to 17 different key points. That next time you go to a primary care doctor, which we're currently in pilot right now, three live pilots happening, one in Vietnam and two in the US, two here locally. Primary care doctor, the clinician will deploy our technologies. Within that, we give you a balance assessment, we give you a comprehensive score, and then we can tell you what the unique about our platform that we have this whole library exercise that we can prescribe to you. And then when you go home, you can lock on your patient portal. So, really, we we really what we want to do, we bridge the band the clinic and home. That is the balance pro. The balance step, the balance pro give you a balance score. And then, of course, the balance, the kidney step is another piece of technical hardware that again we can buy software hardware. As a piece of hardware you wear at your angle, you walk for a hundred steps. We can we collect enough data that we can give you a gate analysis. So we can measure so you have a gate score. We give we know exactly how you walk, we look for the abnormality, we compare your a group. So that's really we build really comprehensive in terms of you know, um, your uh we like to call movement score. We combine bound score and gate score, give you move score, a very comprehensive understanding of your biomechanics.

SPEAKER_00: 23:27

Yeah, so a hardware and a software stack that empowers people to make better decisions about their their health, right? In general. That makes a lot of sense. Um you mentioned piloting Kenneth's AI in both the US and in Vietnam. Um just curious, can you can you tell us some differences that you've noticed about adoption and uh what what do those pilots teach you about scaling globally?

SPEAKER_01: 23:52

Yeah, so let's talk about that. So we start out with Vietnam market first, and to be honest, we do have a team based in Vietnam there, all our signed team. So we have a signed team, we have an engineer team, a product team. Our signed team is we have a right now a four-doctor US base here in the US, and we do have a product and an engineer team based in Vietnam. So Pilot Vietnam, why Vietnam? Because that's where uh, of course, our engineer team there, we built the products. Um, and we found a clinic, which is one of the most innovative clinic in the country. The reason at the beginning we was we what we were using that clinic to kind of as a quick way for us to test the products. And then when we found the clinic, we have learned that, hey, Vietnam market, uh physical theory market is fairly new. The Vietnam uh, and for the most part, and we when we look at the population, there's 100 million people in Vietnam right now, there are 15 million right now that need uh access to this kind of service, which they don't have access to. Because in Vietnam, uh right now, the current, we look at the current solution, you have private clinic, which is very expensive, you have to go, and then you have the hospital, which is state-owned hospital, which is under um developed in the moment. So we have the big gap in the middle, uh, the middle market not being served. And we say, hey, there's an opportunity for us to bring this U.S. you know, great quality um science with the technology to serve the middle market. So we deploy that. Uh that's why we decided to go ahead and pilot in Vietnam first. And based on uh the feedback, the adoption rate, uh, we have been very, very successful. And the one beautiful thing when it comes to you build these products, which is what we're trying to do right now is something kind of different because you when you look at our competition, it's people doing like more like fragmented when we do more comprehensive. So by working clinics that have a closed feedback loop that allows to speed up the development. So we build a product, we test a clinic, we get feedback from the clinician, we get feedback from the patient. So that's that's that's going well. So overall, the adoption rate, the big challenge for us since Vietnam is a developed country, low income now, it's trying to get into the middle income economy. The the the the patient or the customer, the big challenge for us is to education. We have to educate why the physical therapy, because that for them, most of them, uh physical therapy is like traditional um Asian masay or some sort of medicine, something. So that's a big adoption, the big hurdle that we have to spend a lot of time educate the public from that perspective. Now, you ship back to the US, we partner. So what we learn in Vietnam, uh, we back basically uh allow us to speed up the development uh of the software and the hardware, and then by the time we get to the US, um which we are officially kick up one uh two pilot right now, uh make the process a lot easier because um it takes a lot of work um to do to have an official clinical pilot here in the US. So um think about Vietnam is like a pre-market, pre-pilot. We like where we fine-tune the product product, and then when we get to the US, we are in a much better shape in terms of you know, make sure we are clinically um uh we have all the steps, the protocol in play, make sure that we are built according to AWF, HIPAA compliance, so forth and so on.

SPEAKER_00: 27:03

Yeah, yeah, I was thinking the regulatory advantages of learning from your approach in Vietnam and bringing those lessons back to the US makes a lot of sense. Um and and you sound extremely focused, and your roadmap is super ambitious. You've got clinical applications, sports performance, and even military readiness. So, how do you decide where to focus without losing momentum?

SPEAKER_01: 27:29

Yeah, that that's that's that's something I I I'm I batter with every day. But at the end of the day, for us, what we have designed app, you know, I think um we didn't want to be just another platform uh uh wellness app that gives generic information. There's a lot of that on the market already. What we position now sell that we want to be clinical, giving clinical uh data. So for us, um in order to, you know, you let talk about roadmap, you know, uh getting support and performance, getting, you know, of course, the human digital twin and the military application, we cannot achieve any of that if we are not successful on the clinical phase one first. Because to us, we still validate the technology. That's why we do these pilot programs, so we can show up do case studies so we can show effectiveness. And along the way, there's a lot we still have to figure out, and we can't figure out everything on our own. So that means we have to leverage the doctor, the clinician, every, and the patient. So that is what we have to say. We in order, yes, it's good to be ambitious. It's good that that's why I spend 10% of my time thinking about the future application, whether in the in the military application, how we're gonna empower the soldier on the ground to make sure that he we optimize his movement, uh, how we're gonna empower the next athlete to um reduce the his injury, optimize the performance. But those are great things, but we can't get there unless we are we are successful on the clinical phase. That's why as I think about the step-by-step process, I I want to be very focused on do one thing well before we can try to do too many other things.

SPEAKER_00: 29:04

Yeah, yeah. I think about my lack of knowledge here is obvious, but military boots, right? How they how soldiers have to march in these boots and how uncomfortable that must feel uh to be marching for miles and miles on end. And because I've been running my whole life and I know how important it is to find the right pair of shoes, I really hope that you know, if if the military um grade boots haven't come a long way that you offer them something um that they can really leverage and and I just imagine how uncomfortable those things are and how I would be impacted if I had to march around in those things, that's for sure.

SPEAKER_01: 29:43

So yeah, may I share a little bit on like this? I want to spend about 30 seconds, expand on that a little bit, the military application. Yeah, you're right. A lot of these, they boot a heavy, a lot of soldiers, but I think for us, uh there are more that we envision, imagine that you go into in a battlefield. Environment that we can have sensor, that we can sense the environment, we can sense your heart rate, we can have live veto haptic to your that wide and that can measure your heart rate, how you perform, and we can guide you if you should think the left to the right. We can have lighter. Think of imagine we have LIDA built into the boot. So think about these smart shoes. So there's a lot more application than beyond just you know making the boot less heavier. And we can measure your stress, we can measure heart rate, we can tell you how you perform in that environment. Imagine we have a command center that these feedback go back to these command centers, so we can see tactical how the soldier operates in certain environments. So there are more applications that we can bring to that because there's so much, because at the end of it, you and the you're facing the enemy, you're in an environment that you're not sure you navigate. So there's a lot of decision-making process happening. Every single step counts. So there's a lot more information that we can collect and feed to the command center, and we can evaluate how you perform in that environment. So think about so there's a lot more obligation that we, you know, that's something to excite me. If I if we something that we can, if for us as a company, eventually we we we want to work with the DOD, that we can develop a technology, whether hardware or software, that we can empower the soldier at that environment, if we can that kind of whether that safe life or in any kind of rescue mission as well. So there's a lot more that we want to expand into.

SPEAKER_00: 31:27

That's beautiful. Uh tell me a little bit about your sports performance uh vision there, because you know it's a it's very inspiring to hear how you can help with soldiers and and their missions, but um, I feel like there's there's a lot of optimization around sports performance that would be just absolute gold to the industry. I'm just curious what what your vision is there.

SPEAKER_01: 31:49

Yeah, I mean, for for me and an athlete, so I compete in Spartan Race and an athlete, there's two things you always have to, you always have to make the decision. Um, optimizing, because as an athlete, you're always optimizing. Okay. And at the same time, you risk injure yourself. So you only have to make the decision. So for us, is how can't we collect enough data that we can help you optimize to achieve what XYZ, because we know that performance perspective. But at the same time, it's equally important. How can we, as you optimize the thing, we have to balance out the risk factor. So think about you, your now we know your your running gate, your distance, your heart rate. We take everything in consideration. So what we envision is that if you have an ambo watch, a fitbit, you have a lot of upper body analytical rate. We can tie that into our lower body of biomechanic data. And now what we can do, we can look the whole body of biometrics. Because right now, we know a lot about the upper, a lot of athlete injury actually lower body injury. A lot of injury is lower body. So, but lower body, if you look at on the market, you look at all the wearable devices, the only thing you get for the most part, your step, your distance, your calorie. But other than that, a lot of it's still black box.

SPEAKER_00: 33:02

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01: 33:03

And we want to be able, what what with our technology when it comes to the balance pro, kidney step, we eventually for the we will launch a sport and performance division, the kidney's pro. Uh, because and that's where we can start to really give you a uh a very comprehensive understanding about your low body bomb mechanic. By giving you that, we can know what sport you play, we know what type, you know, is it balanced. I'll give you an example, golf. If you play golf, balance is extremely important when to golf. And we can tell you that. We can tell exactly what foot, what angle you need to focus on. How are you gonna optimize that? So yeah.

SPEAKER_00: 33:40

Yeah, any any breakthroughs in the near future on how to optimize for uh shin splint prevention?

SPEAKER_01: 33:49

Sorry. Um, a lot of that you don't need that, it's just running mechanics.

SPEAKER_00: 33:53

Yeah, okay, okay.

SPEAKER_01: 33:54

Running mechanics. I mean, we can help, but I think a lot of that, let's say the human body is an incredible machine. I look at it as an incredible machine piece of engineering that took two million years of evolution. So it's sometimes what we what what I find, including myself, that a lot of, you know, we we we have a lot of product in the markets, a lot of that through clever marketing. But if you literally break down the science, human, we have been running for mile and mile. We are persistent hunter, we didn't have shoe, we didn't have all that stuff that we we call nowadays that you can buy off on the market, but it's understanding, using the body naturally, understand your biomechanics.

SPEAKER_00: 34:34

Got it. Well, speaking of understanding, you mentioned this before, the human digital twin sounds pretty fascinating. So, what possibilities does that unlock for predicting, preventing, and optimizing our performance?

SPEAKER_01: 34:48

Well, thank you for talking about, you know, you know, for me, um, as I, you know, try to focus on everything we do and on a daily basis, on a weekly or monthly basis, um, these are the moonshot projects. You know, I'm gonna call it moonshot project, but I think, but I believe that the future we're heading to. Because what we we we envision, especially in the healthcare space, um, the way we do right now, we we diagnose, we then the doctor um will have will look at different options, different treatment to figure out the right treatment for you. I'll give you an example. You have a, let's say, for me, if I have cancer and the doctor do a biopsy and all that stuff and say, they will test different drug to see how my body will react to that. So, and and whenever you do that, that puts a lot of stress on the body for the patient. And it's also costly. So we there's a still, so what we hope to do, we say, what if? Because the human bodies, and I talked a little bit about biointelligent. We should human body, the human body give out signal. But what we need to do is figure out how to capture these data, turn them to data so we can turn into something that can be useful for us. So the whole idea of the human digital project that let's say you already have a lot of analytical data from your wearable devices, whether from your wrist, from your ring, from your band, and then you have our technology at the bottom. Now, if we can collect all of data over this period of time, then what we what I would allow us to do, and of course, you have we collect your nutrition, your daily activity, your health, you know, your background about your overall health, and what we should be able to do, build a digital version of Jason. So now Jason says, hey, Vincent, you know, I want to do this 20, you know, Richmond marathon and say, Jason, what we have all your heart rate data, we have all your biomechanics data over the last how many months or or weeks, we will build, let's, and we know the terrain that you're gonna run, we know the environment, we know everything, that given data, and we're gonna let your digital version run to see and what what happened is we want to be able to pinpoint where the deficiency at that point. And when when that allows us to identify, say, so Jason, instead, for you kind of focus on general idea training, we can pinpoint exactly where you can fork your training. Law for speaking, what we love to do is if we can take, let's say, if somebody over 50, and if and we will build a digital version of this person, we can project out five years, 10 years, 20 years from now, the progression. Whether the body is just human nature, it's just sign that the body degray over time. So, but we can project that out based and based on what we know about you, based on your current activity, based on your nutrition, based on your movement pattern, we can predict that. So that is really the at this point, a broader view of what we believe the human digital twin would allow it to do.

SPEAKER_00: 37:41

Yeah. Wow, that's that's incredible. If I had a goal of one day running in a half or a full marathon, I could leverage my digital twin to help me optimize my performance and my workout program and based on all of the data that it has on me. That would be really incredible. And then just being able to kind of map out what the future of my, I want to say my balance program, if you will, like everything that that would matter to me in the next 20 years based on the data where I'm projected to be, and make informed decisions about how I want to continue doing what I'm doing today or changing what I'm doing today so that I can have a better outcome in the next 20 years, that would be incredible. That would be absolutely incredible. And t tell us a little bit about your work with the Balance Health Academy, where you're embedding your work into science. How do you how do you balance the need for rigorous clinical validation and with the speed expected from a startup?

SPEAKER_01: 38:43

Yeah, that is actually really critical to us as a company. Um, what we want to do if we're gonna tell somebody about their balance, their movement, and then and how we can help them to optimize their movement so previous to prevent some of the um the outcome which you fall and and enjoy later on. Um so we want to, every layer of our technology stack, we embed sign to that. So we have that's why we have a sign team. So the way we did you make decisions as a company, um, because to me that's that's important that that you know it's going back to the the the original the you know, since we start uh kennis barefoot as a company is look at we look at you from the sign perspective. So so that has been rooted deep into uh our DNA. One we identify the problem, okay, and then and then we always start with the sign team and the first team evaluate that. And then uh, is it a problem? Is it scientifically? Have we looked at it from the side? Are there any research back that up? And then the next thing we start to look at uh you know solution, and the scientist will be the team that decides on the solution because we want to make sure that when we put out the product, it's going through this rigorous step-by-step process. So somebody, when when we tell a patient, whether a patient, whether a clinician that we have the tool, we want to make sure that we have do everything humanly possible from our end, whether from the technology standpoint, uh from the data privacy perspective, whether from the scientific perspective, we have done everything that we can to ensure that we deliver the best product that we can deliver to our customers. So it is critical. Um, our science team once we'll go back to the workflow for us. The science team wants with the protocol, we've developed the solution, and that's where the engineer will come back on the back end. So the sign team have the a lot of uh the veto uh veto right. And of course, there's always cohesiveness between sign and engineer. We all get in the room together before we actually co a single line.

SPEAKER_00: 40:42

Awesome. And I know that the Richmond startup ecosystem has really fueled your journey there. So what has the local community given you exactly? And and how do you see yourself giving back as a founder?

SPEAKER_01: 40:56

A lot. Well, the local community giving me a lot. So I mentioned uh Start Virginia is a great ecosystem. We've been a member since 2018. Um, and then you have Lighthouse Lap, again, a lot of mentors. Um, we got here today, you know. I say the reason I were able to kind of connect with my mentor, to my mentor, unfortunately, pass away, which he does make the project even more personal for me. Um, you know, Steve and the other one, uh Cox is one of my long-term uh mentors who passed away as well. So we, for me personally, that I want to dedicate this project to their legacy. Well, they believe in me. Um, so um, so Virginia Lihau Laugh, Virginia Innovation Partners Partnership, uh, the ICAP program. So, yeah, these are um these are great organizations. That's that's why, you know, I I always thank for their support, um, the grant, of course, uh, and of course, access to all the mentors. So for me to get in back is and I share with everybody, you know, um I'm open, you know, you reach out to me on LinkedIn, I'm happy to share with you anytime. Um, but all I ask you that, you know, you are you want to make sure that you do your homework uh before you come and spend time with me because I want to make sure that whether I'm spending you 30 minutes or an hour, uh, we walk away something that inspires you to take the next action. So um uh I will I will continue my mental legacy by sharing what I have learned over the years.

SPEAKER_00: 42:18

Beautiful. Yeah. Always try to pay it forward. That's that's that's a great thing. So for innovators in in challenging tech industries and health tech specifically, where there are many risks high and and timelines are long. So what's the what's the mindset required to stay resilient?

SPEAKER_01: 42:39

Well, you at the end of the day, you you have to have a purpose. You know, your why. You know, we start with a why. Your why have to be bigger than your problem, because problem will come every single day. You have I have more setback than you can imagine. But at the end of the day, if your why, you have a strong purpose while you're doing it, and and I I learned this over the year. Don't do it because you you think uh startup is something that's glamorous, that you you've been portraying me that it's a long journey. I have been in Barkney's years for the last eight years. I have committed myself, and to me, um that's something that I'm passionate about because I think about the the impact that we'll deliver to the people we're helping. To me, that's that's keep that keep me get up every day. And um, it's a journey. You have to enjoy that. You have to live it. You have to live to the the moment that you feel like, why am I doing it? You pull your hair out, you stay up one or two o'clock in the morning, you have to be willing to give up a lot of things. You have to be willing to humility. People misunderstood, not everybody will get you, but that's okay. But that's why you need to find yourself as some great mentor. You have to have your you'll have um, you have to be able to really truly love what you do because it's gonna be very difficult. And lastly, um, you know, I start shoe business not knowing anything about shoe. I start a digital health company, not knowing anything about health or health tech or technology or sensor, but I can learn. Stay curious, learning. Stop, you know, I read so many books about uh sensor hardware. Uh, I went and talked to a lot of people. You don't need to be an expert. Sometimes to me, inexperience is the best thing that can happen to you. Not knowing is the best thing can happen to you, but you have to uh know uh at the end of the day that um you have to persevere, uh persistent, patient, uh, and purpose. Those are the things that that I highly recommend you should consider before you think about enter any kind of uh industry if you want to make something innovative.

SPEAKER_00: 44:38

Yeah, yeah. I love uh knowing your why, and that's gonna be what gets you out of bed in the morning and keeps you moving. And not knowing everything and just being able to bring the bring the experts in the room with you to answer the questions. I think that's that's really powerful stuff. And you all you often speak about mobility and wellness across the human lifespan. How does that perspective uh influence the way that you lead your company and your personal vision of longevity?

SPEAKER_01: 45:06

Yeah, mobility has always been important to me. Um going back to, you know, I think after I enjoy myself, and the next thing I know, I started a shoe company. In 2022, I end up running a uh a barefoot marathon. Not because I wanted to. Uh for me, there's two things that happened there. I ran a barefoot marathon, took me six and a half hours. I ran a marathon because I was trying to raise money for the Afghan refugee, being a refugee myself. Um, it resonated. It it to me, it it there's two things I want to raise money, and the other thing I want to prove that the human body is an amazing machine. I couldn't run two miles indoors, and after I make the transition, here I am uh at age 39. Um, who knows then then I am end up running uh the the barefoot marathon. So mobility is important. We talk about, you know, I was out in in uh San Francisco pitching uh to a group of VC on a longevity market. You know, longevity is a big thing nowadays, longevity, wellness, health span. But when you look at longevity over in in and we need to define how do we define that? Well, you can't have longevity or wellness or health span if you don't have mobility. Think about it. We we take our mobility for granted, but until you don't have it, that changed your life drastically. So mobility to to me, that's that's to me the first of the thing, and and something that we need to um we need to take time and then take care of our ability to move, which is starting to balance your gait. So so we can enjoy, we can do activity. You can go out, play soccer with your kid, um, you can go for a long hike. That's that to me that's important.

SPEAKER_00: 46:41

All of that makes so much sense. Uh so let's let's fast forward 10 years from now. What does success for Kennis AI look like? Not just for you, but your patients, communities, and the society at large.

SPEAKER_01: 46:56

Absolutely. Um, what we envision the future where um you know I talk about a lot, you know, mobility is the beginning, but what we're looking about is preventive care. What we want to do, preventive care should be accessible, uh uh, should be accessible from uh to me, it's it should be um a human right to do that because right now um preventive care in in general uh is still a very uh it's only a very selective group of people. There's over 8 billion people on this planet that we're sharing, we call home. But preventive care doesn't apply, it's only applied to a small group of us. So what we envision success means that we will leverage technologies and and um and build an ecosystem where we want, you know, think about uh, you know, the this new idea, a digital hospital that focuses on preventive health. That's what success means to us. That means we have a global digital hospital that we want to make prevent and get access to everyone and anyone. And that means we can build technology with hardware and software. Um, the idea of going to a traditional hospital model, I think there's an opportunity that we there's a lot of deficiency for that and also creates a lot of limited access to a lot of folks. Imagine that we have a digital hospital, for the first digital hospital that we can make access, that we can have technology and it's gonna be both software and hardware. We make preventive care accessible for everyone who wants to have that.

SPEAKER_00: 48:16

And that is the future.

SPEAKER_01: 48:18

Yes.

SPEAKER_00: 48:18

Yes. I see it. I'm with you. And I wish you the best of luck making that that future uh happen for everyone. But Vincent, I want to thank you. Your story is a reminder that innovation often comes from reimagining the overlook and turning it into something transformative. So what what stood out to for me today was that's the kind of ambitious vision the world needs more of. So thank you. And for our listeners, I hope today's conversation sparks a new perspective on what health movement and innovation can mean in the age of AI. So until next time, I'm Jason McGenthy reminding you to stay curious, keep innovating, and always look for ways of the future proof of your knowledge.

SPEAKER_01: 49:10

Yeah, I I just want to say thank you. I and and always say I I really resonate when you say stay curious. Curiosity, that's what makes it human. Yes, stay curious. And just you gotta start from somewhere. Now now is the time.

SPEAKER_00: 49:25

Start start from what is your why and tracking the right problem. Yeah, that's correct. Well, I learned a lot from you today, so thank you so much.

SPEAKER_01: 49:34

Thank you, James.

SPEAKER_00: 49:35

I know our audience is gonna really enjoy this one.

SPEAKER_01: 49:38

Thank you so much for for giving me the opportunity to share um, you know, my personal story and and also kinda story and how we're gonna uh inspire uh the next generation of entrepreneurs and also the the people that uh the lives that we're gonna impact with our technologies.